Metacognitive Programming: Psychotherapy Meets Life Coaching

Misha Saidov

Mike Warkentin: 

It’s another edition of Two-Brain Radio. Here’s your host, Chris Cooper.

Chris Cooper: 

Hey, it’s Chris Cooper. And my guest today is Mikhail Saidov- Misha to his friends. Misha is the creator and originator of metacognitive programming, a discipline that combines psychotherapy with life coaching. And it’s a very interesting discipline because it’s more than just digging into your past and finding out what’s limiting you, but it’s also the ability to prescribe methods to actually improve someone’s life. Now, if you’re listening to this, like me, you’re probably pretty skeptical of the term “life coach”. and the term life coach is getting used by a lot of people right now. Some of those people should probably not be giving you financial or life advice, let’s face it. But what a lot of listeners might not remember is that 20 years ago, the term personal trainer was viewed with a lot of the same skepticism. We saw somebody wearing a personal trainer shirt in a gym, and we thought, “What gives that person the right to tell me what to do?” Or “Who gave that person permission to be the expert?” And when I became a personal trainer, this era was still just kind of waning. There were a couple of personal trainers in my town who had been through that, that skepticism. Even people saying to them, like, “You? You’re not the biggest fittest dude in the gym. Why are you telling anybody else how to work out ?” And the same is true for life coaching and what has to happen when you’ve got a brand new school of thought, or a new process is that you start it up and you get a whole bunch of people jump on board . And some of those people are not qualified. And over time, one of two things can happen. The best people in the new field can kind of band together, professionalize the field and create something that is worth following, paying attention to or considering as even a career choice. The other thing that can happen is that they get laughed out of the building. Mikhail is one of these first in the first category. He is legitimizing the field of life coaching, and he is teaching metacognitive programming. And after chatting with him, I was kind of blown away by, like, what this could do. But even if you’re only interested in ever being a fitness coach, there are elements of metacognitive programming that will help you get better adherence, results, accountability for your clients. And so I think this is a very valid listen, even if only because this is where our field came from, this thing created out of the ether to help people better legitimize through trial and error, and finally built on the backs of thousands of personal trainers who didn’t get it right so that we could. Without any further ado, here’s Misha on Two-Brain Radio. Misha , welcome to Two-Brain Radio.

Mikhail Saidov: 

Hey, thank you. Thank you for having me.

Chris Cooper: 

Yeah. I’m really excited about this and we’re gonna dive right in. I gave a little bit of your bio already, so I wanted to start by asking you as a life coach. What do you think everybody wants from life?

Mikhail Saidov: 

I think this is the most interesting and popular question I get from my clients and from everyone else. And I prefer to give a long answer and , um, you know, the answer is what I call the new FERMI paradox . So, you know, the old FERMI paradox probably, right? So the FERMI, he’s a scientist and this idea, he was discussing with his buddies. And at some point they started discussing aliens and the FERMI asked, okay, you know, if aliens exist, where are they ? Basically life exists beyond our planet. Where is it? Why don’t we see it? The new FERMI paradox is similar in its paradoxical ways , but it’s not similar in obviously, any scientific approach, of course. So the FERMI is an abbreviation. And when my clients come to me, they say, “Look, I want to have more money in my life. I want to have a better or new partner. I want to, to create something really meaningful in my life.” So when everyone comes to me, they come for five things and I call them FERMI. F- they come for the flow. And flow is an experience of optimal feeling of engagement in the moment. For example, if you surf , or if you play any game, I’m pretty sure you experienced flow in your life. But to be exact, the way we prefer to describe the experience of being in the flow is when you stop feeling yourself, when you cannot, or when you don’t think about time, so senseless or egoless and timeless, we think about flow when whatever you do is not taking too much effort, so effortless. And finally, it’s when you are in this experience, you are actually overwhelmed by data and you cannot process this data. If you will be in controlled focus attention. So first when my clients come, they say, “Look, I wanna do something that creates this experience of flow. So this is F. E is engagement. They want to be socially engaged. We know that there is a huge correlation between feeling depressed and feeling lonely. So for everyone to have a full life, you need to have enough people around you, enough people that you love , enough people that you care about and enough people that care about you. So that’s the E from FERMI. R is relaxation or being relaxed . And life does not make sense. If there is not enough positive experience in your life , if you don’t have, or you do not live, and your family doesn’t live in comfort, in safety, if your stomach is empty, and if every day you feel afraid, like the life doesn’t make sense. And in order to be relaxed, you know, you;ve gotta be full, rested, and you got to have enough pleasure in your life. So that’s the R. The M is meaning. You need to have meaning in your life. You need to work on something that is bigger than you. You need to have a bigger purpose. So that’s M and the final letter is I, and I, you would want to have an ideal picture life, meaning that you need some level of material success in your life. So that’s the FERMI. Now, where the paradox is coming from. In fact, people do not want FERMI. They just want to feel better. You don’t want to have a better partner. You want to feel better. You don’t want to have more money. You want to feel better. You don’t want to be successful in your life. You want to feel better. You don’t need safety. You want to feel better . So the paradox comes not from attaining the FERMI in your life, but actually from your emotional state. And the great illusion is that we think that by attaining all those things, suddenly we’ll start feeling better. And partially this is true. Circumstances for sure can influence your life. But it’s your mind that creates your human experience. And you can think about the same circumstances from two different angles, and you will feel differently. So this is about perception. So answering your question, everyone wants FERMI, but what I give people as a life coach, I give them experience and I elevate the quality of their human experience. So when they change their perception, suddenly all things become easier in their life. And I think it’s also important here to explain how , um, like my background and how I got into life coaching in the first place, I think. So I got into psychology when I was around 12 years old and I was dealing with constant anxiety and feelings of fear. And at that time, psychology and, and psychotherapists, they were not very popular, especially in my country. I’m coming from Eastern Europe. I’m Jewish, Ukrainian. I live in Canada now. Like many Europeans, I speak many languages, but I work in three languages. So, and I was self helping . I was studying a lot. I was reading many, many books and eventually I got so interested in the field of psychology/psychotherapy that I got my first license as a psychotherapist by the age of 15. And , um, I wrote my first book about correlation between assertiveness and status when I was 18. And by the age of 35, I have created my own modality, psychotherapeutic, and life coach , and modality that is called meta cognitive programming, you know, all that. Yeah. So coming back to FERMI paradox, the most interesting question about FERMI paradox is, “Okay, but how do you know that you can actually achieve FERMI in your life? You can achieve flow engagement, meaning, you know, relaxation and ideal picture life . How do you know that you have what it takes? How do you know that this is the moment for you to hire a life coach? And we discussed that before, and I , I want to share that with your audience as well, the way you know, that is when you feel what I call emergence, present-future gap. So this is a mouthful. Let’s take it one by one, right? So what is emergence? Emergence is the term that comes from the fields of biology and physics. And if I can explain emergence in a simpler or, you know, common language, so emergence is the idea of how stupid things become smart. For example, if you think about a honeybee or an ant, you know , if , if you look at , at the ant, you know, this creature is very, very simple. It doesn’t have a lot of brains. Its life on its own is pretty meaningless. Okay . However, together with hundreds of thousands of other ants, they create what is called mega colonies and mega colony of ants is one of the most complex and sophisticated things in the world. And this is emergence: when simple things create together, something very, very sophisticated. As human beings, we are, you know, examples of emergence as well, because we all consist of millions of cells and, you know, cells separately, they are very simple, easy to understand. But together, wow. This is really, really hard. And then , and you know, the same goes to energy and thermodynamics and this universe, and pretty much we can see emergence everywhere. So now I was studying emergence for many years in different fields, and I extrapolated the idea of emergence into psychology. So what is present future gap as emergence in psychology? Normally, or generally I work with clients who, when they come, they say, “Look, I feel utterly unrealized in my life.” And they say, “You know, sometimes I’m looking at myself in the mirror and I think, wow, I thought that by this time you should have been way ahead.” And that’s pretty much the story of every client I have. So what is actually happening is that everyone, at some point in their lives , they feel that they are created- they’re meant for more. And this is the moment of emergence. This is how incredibly sophisticated, you know, DNA tells them that, Hey, you know what? It seems, we have power and energy to get what we want. We have enough resources to get you to FERMI. So that’s the idea that in present, you are not fully satisfied and happy with your life. And somewhere from within, there is a voice, let’s call it a melody of life or a melody of your soul or your DNA that tells you, “It seems we have a resource to achieve more. Let’s do it . You need to find help. You need to find resources. You need to find connections. You need to find actions to make it happen.” And when there is a gap, I know that I can take the client from the present to FERMI.

Chris Cooper: 

So what exactly is that gap? Is it the feeling that I can do more, but I don’t know how?

Mikhail Saidov: 

Yes. It’s a feeling of being unrealized. It is a feeling of your life being meaningless and useless, but at the same time, there is a fire of interest in you. And it’s not that you think that life is useless and you feel depressed and you want to commit suicide. It’s a different story. This story is about, “I wanna find a way. I’m pretty sure there is a way it’s just not available to me now. And I think I can do it once I’m clear about what to do.”

Chris Cooper: 

Okay . So when you’re in this gap, are you, do you have dreams about what you could become? Or are you thinking more of these, you know, FERMI goals as concrete goals?

Mikhail Saidov: 

Yes. Okay , awesome. So let’s talk about dreams versus goals. So again , when I work with clients , I specify for them . And I explain what is the difference between dreams and goals. Dream is something that is pretty much impossible for you. And someone needs to wave a magic wand to make it happen. So when you are dreaming, it’s not about you, it’s about cooperation and collaboration from the universe to make it possible for you. So, and here we are in the field of esoterics, but basically dreaming is a good exercise because when you truly believe in something for yourself, it’s not a dream anymore. It’s a goal. But when you think, “Okay, I wish that to happen to me, but I’m not gonna do anything for that to happen. And I hope that one day maybe it happens.” That’s a dream. And the criteria of any dream is that there is no resistance for you for the dream to happen. It means that you do not actively wish for that dream to come true , because you truly believe it is impossible. So you don’t think that it’s important to think about the dream every day . Now, if you think about a goal and you believe that this is something you need to do, suddenly it’s not a dream anymore, but it is an outline of steps for yourself, right? So when clients come to me I say, “We are not gonna dream here, we want to come closer to goals.” And then I explain to them that there is a difference between desired goals and non desired goals.

Chris Cooper: 

Maybe you should tell us the difference there then.

Mikhail Saidov: 

Yeah. Okay . So when there is something you desire, let’s say, you know , you are in , in a fitness space. And , let’s say I desire- By the way, it’s true. For many years, I want to put probably 10 kilos of muscle. Okay. Never worked for me, but I’m still dreaming about it. Okay? So I want that to happen. Now, for me, it is a non desired goal. And here is why. When I think about myself having this muscular chiseled body, of course, I’m excited. Of course, I want to look at myself in the mirror. Of course, probably my wife will be seriously impressed. Might be. Not sure about that, but she might be very impressed. I will be impressed by myself for sure, but I don’t want to do anything to make it happen. I actually hate training. I don’t want to exercise. It’s the worst experience of my life. Okay. If every day I need to go to gym or if every day I need to do something like resistance training or any other type of training. Oh, geez . It’s so hard. So a desired goal is a goal where you do not like the process. And it means that you need a power of will to get to this goal. Now, for things like lose 50 pounds of fat, let’s say, and if the goal is non desired , it’s a dream. Okay . So it’s pretty much impossible. There are very few people who can do it. And you do need a lot of mental power to make it happen. Now let’s take another example. I need to exercise. I understand it. I’m dumb enough, but not that dumb, right? So I’m thinking, “Okay, what can I do to introduce an exercise to my life?” So it becomes a desirable goal. And one of the things that I love is playing tennis. Now my goal is to become one day, sort of like semi-pro in, in tennis. Now, I’m not even close. It’ll take me probably, like, 20 years to get to semipro level. Now I enjoy at the same time playing tennis every day . You know, time goes really fast. I am in the flow. I love it. I enjoy it. I can do it every day . Suddenly this is a goal because I enjoy the everyday process. So one of the things that every good life coach has to do for her clients or his clients is to turn dreams into goals and non desired goals into desired outcomes.

Chris Cooper: 

That is very interesting. And I don’t wanna take us off track here, but you know, you’re talking to fitness coaches and most of our clients have these dreams of losing 20 or 30 pounds, but they don’t really want to do the exercise. You know, is there a way that we can help them overcome it?

Mikhail Saidov: 

Yeah, they, they don’t want to do the exercise. They don’t want to fast, right. Or, you know, to reduce the amount of calories they’re taking , all of that. They don’t want to work with emotional overeating. They just want to wake up one day in a better shape. That’s pretty much it. So I will share an example from my practice, actually. And in this practice, I was a client, not a coach. So basically if you believe in life coaching and psychotherapy, you do hire life coaches and psychotherapists for yourself. Otherwise it is not fair. Otherwise you are not taking your own product. You are not using the product you’re selling to other people. Right? So I have a fitness coach and his name is Jersey Gregorick. And it is Naval Ravikant who introduced me to Jersey. And , uh , Jersey is an incredible human being. He’s a poet, and he’s also a fitness coach. He’s also , I think he’s in the Guinness book of records for Olympic weightlifting. I don’t exactly remember what exactly he has done there, but I know that he’s a powerhouse. So when he started working with me and what Jersey requires you to do is actually to follow a set regimen for every day . Now, for someone like myself, this is incredibly hard. And I’m telling him, “Look, I don’t want to exercise. It sucks.” And he asked me, “So what do you do? Like, every morning, what do you do?” And I was like, “I meditate.” “How do you meditate? Do you like meditation?” I’m like, “Yeah. You know, I sit still. And I focus, and this is how I meditate. He’s like, “Have you heard of dynamic meditation?” I’m like, “Of course I’ve heard of dynamic meditation. I’ve I’ve done many, many of them.” “Do you like dynamic meditations?” “Yes, I do.” He’s like, “You know what? My set of exercises is a dynamic meditation.” So in this moment, what he’s doing to me, and this is what we do in meta cognitive programing all the time, he changed my thinking. He moved me from current thinking to intentional thinking or to future thinking. And when he changed this mental paradigm, suddenly it has become easy. I don’t exercise. I meditate. Now when I meditate, it happens so that my body gets stronger. And it seems that at some point of my life, I will be an Olympic weightlifter. So this is an example of someone moving you from non desired outcome to a desired outcome.

Chris Cooper: 

Yeah. That’s such a great example, Misha. Thank you. Okay, good. So I pulled you off track there, please continue.

Mikhail Saidov: 

Yeah. So once you understand the difference between goals, you also understand what life coaching is about. Life coaching is about helping someone creating a life that is worth living. This is what is life coaching is about. We work with functional clients who on the scale of FERMI, maybe they have flow sometimes. Maybe they have meaning sometimes, but obviously in those letters, they’re not performing really well. And we help them get there. But at the same time, MCP meta cognitive programming is not only for life coaches. It is also for psychotherapists. So the way we differentiate between therapy and life coaching, and this is how we explain that to our clients. And we train therapists and life coaches, and the training is the same. It is just the stage of life that is different. So you need a therapist, you need a psychotherapist. And we train MCP therapists or MCP life coaches- And MCP life coaches. So the way of understanding the therapist is when your life is in crumbles. So you need to stabilize first because there is no life worth living if you’re not stabilized. Now, what does it mean to stabilize? If you’re completely lonely and you don’t have any relationships, even, like, not one, it means that you’re not stable. If you don’t have any way to support yourself financially, it means that you’re not stable. If you are low, or if your everyday experience is negative emotions only. You’re depressed. You’re anxious. You are grieving. You are trying to survive. You need to stabilize. And for stabilization, you need a psychotherapist. Okay? Now, once you’re stabilized, before you can start creating big things in your life, before you will hire a life coach, you still need to make one more step. And this step we call clarity. So for clarity, what it means to be clear. You see, everyone has big baggage from our previous lives. Someone was victimized. Someone experienced a lot of traumas. Someone had a good life, but still has a lot of limiting beliefs about the world. And, you know , whatever this person sees is distorted by those beliefs. And we need a psychotherapist to clear it for you to help you clear it for yourself until you’re completely clear and completely present in the moment. Now, once that happens , this is like, and this feels so big in life. This moment of clarity is unbelievable. It’s like being born again. Now, once that happened to you, okay, suddenly you need a life coach. Because the next step is creating a new identity. When we say creating a new identity, it’s not about, you know, trying to become someone else. There is a popular word in psychology, in motivation and self-help is transformation. We don’t use transformation because we don’t want to turn triangles into circles and circles, you know, into pyramids . It doesn’t make sense at all. It’s just a really bad idea because we, as you know, as psychologists, as life coaches, we believe in what is called biological determination. We think that you are born complete. You’re just confused. And you don’t need to try to become someone else, you need just to find what is your own emergency and emergence as well. So emergency is about what you need to do now. Emergence is about who you can become. Okay ? So that’s the, you know , third stage when you suddenly reinvent yourself to find who you’ve always been, and this is the moment when your mind becomes calm, tranquil and unstoppable. And after that, there is a final stage. It’s the fourth stage. And to be in our system, you need to be a master coach to be able to bring someone to the fourth stage. And the fourth stage is called alchemy. And this is- So, backstory. One of my personal heroes is Carl Gustav Jung, famous psychologist. And at some point they were friends with Freud and they were friends for four years, but then their values set them apart. And , uh , Jung went ahead to create an incredible amount of things in his life. And what is special about Carl Jung is that he was a medical doctor, psychiatrist and scientist, and also he was incredibly religious. But not religious in a way that he believed in Christianity only, or in Quran or in Buddhism. He was what we currently- like nowadays, is called spiritual. Okay? And he was able to unite the idea of alchemy with science because basically alchemy is the inner science and he was able to unite those two things. And the state of alchemy is when you can move things from formless to form; when you see something that is presently not manifested, and you actually manifest that into reality. Now I don’t want to use this new age language because I actually get irritated by those definitions. So I prefer to be, be more on the science part of it, based on observation, based on specific criteria, et cetera . But what I strongly believe is that every great scientist in the history of humanity was an Alchemist. You know, if we think about Einstein, if we think about Maxwell, if we think about Darwin, everything they had created, before them was nonexistent, it was formless. And they were able to manifest that into the form; new symbols and new knowledge.

Chris Cooper: 

So where does metacognitive programming fit into all of this?

Mikhail Saidov: 

Okay , perfect question . And perfect segue into that . So what is meta cognitive programming? We believe that you cannot directly affect human behavior . That’s the reason why common sense and advice doesn’t work. Like you cannot give advice and expect that this advice will be followed. I know that many people still try to give others advice. Doesn’t really work, especially if you know, it is not asked for. But the way we change behavior is by modifying the emotion. And the way we modify the emotion is by changing the thought process. So let’s explain the first part and then move to the thought processes after. There are only two types of emotions, it is either the emotion of approach, for example, love or wonder like surprise or looking for surprise , like joy and even sadness. These are emotions that create this certain chemistry in your body that makes you come closer to the object. So a good example is Pavlovian behavioral theory, he would ring a bell. The dog will start salivating and will come to the bell. Okay. Why? The chemistry will be dopamine, right, in the dog’s body. And dopamine, probably norepinephrine will make dog move towards the object. Okay . So the second group of emotions make you distance yourself from the object. It’ll make you either freeze or run. Okay. By the way, the emotion of anger is an emotion of approach as well. When you’re angry, you want to move towards the object and either destroy object or do , or , um , subordinate the object or do something with the object. Okay . So emotions of distance, these are shame, guilt, fear, right? And pretty much every other negative emotion that I didn’t mention. So this is how you understand how emotion influences behavior or action, right? Another emotion is an emotion of repulsion. That’s the emotion of distancing yourself from , from the knowledge . So if you want people to go ahead and make things happen, you need to make them feel a certain way. They either gotta feel interest or love, or anger. That’s pretty much it. So the first principle of MCP is that you need to modify emotion if you need an action to happen. Or, if you want to stop doing something, you need to modify emotion as well. Now, how do we modify emotions? And the only way to modify emotion is through our thinking. And this is the basic premise of cognitive behavioral therapy: That every thought will create a certain emotion and that emotion will create behavior. So to change someone’s feelings, we need to change someone’s thinking process. And the way you change someone’s thinking process is through three steps. You make them aware of what they think. You make them abandon what they think, and you help them find a new model of thinking. The reason we call this practice meta cognitive- and meta can be translated as about. So we teach our coaches and therapists to discuss, or to think about clients’ thinking. Not about clients’ words, not about clients’ content, not about clients’ feelings, but about clients’ thinking; about clients’ cognition. So about cognition is meta, cognitive or meta thinking, Okay, now why programming? So we want to change the behavior permanently. So we need someone to start behaving a new way, and the way you start behaving a new way is by thinking new thoughts every new day. Okay ? So we need to train our clients to think differently. And we use what is called neuroplasticity for our clients to accept new ways and this is what the MCP about and the promise, the overall promise of meta cognitive programming is that currently the program, the mental program you are using is not effective for your life. Because you see, if you don’t have FERMI in your life, the reason you don’t have FERMI is because your behavior is not effective. The reason your behavior is not effective is because you’re not feeling proper emotions for that behavior. And the reason you do not feel proper emotions is because your thinking model is not efficient for that. So if we give you a better model, if we help you find a better model, you will be able to change your behavior, and you will find what you’re looking for in your life. And that’s the promise. Now, this approach is incredibly, incredibly effective . My company today is conducting 1000+ sessions every week. We have thousands of clients. We’ve certified almost 1000 of coaches. And our goal is to have MCP as a golden standard on every continent of life coaching and psychotherapy.

Chris Cooper: 

How does somebody become a life coach? Or get training for metacognitive programming if they are already a psychotherapist?

Mikhail Saidov: 

Yes, it is great if they are already serious about this work. Because there was something in the first place that attracted them to join the profession, right? And if they already were certified as coaches, life coaches, or psychotherapists, that just shows me that they’re very serious about this profession, and they want to progress. It takes them 12 months to train with me directly. Normally I’m taking small groups and I’m training these groups myself. Plus my coaches, my master coaches, we train and we teach. And we make sure that they have enough practice. And in 12 months they are able to do three things. They’re able to work one-on-one using MCP modality. They are able to work as facilitators in group settings with MCP modality or through MCP modality. And they are changing the approach to business coaching as well, because we teach them how to coach businesses as well, but only for those who want to take that as their next steps. Okay . But, you know, in years of our practice and you know, the life of the company, pretty much every coach we certified became a very, very successful coach. Because the way we approach things, the way we teach is so incredible and unique that they become very, very rare coaches once they graduate. And we don’t take many, for example, this year we’re probably gonna take 20 coaches only to train. And I choose and I interview them personally. And we normally accept 10 to 15%. And in 12 months we certify only 45%. So those who want to join us, they need to understand in advance that we do not promise certification in the end. But if they got certified, it pretty much means they are one of the best in the world. <laugh>

Chris Cooper: 

Very interesting. And I love how you are kind of leading the way in the world of life coaching , partially by establishing a credential that is very hard to get

Mikhail Saidov: 

Mm-hmm <affirmative>

Chris Cooper: 

Yes. You don’t always see that amount of rigor or challenge in becoming a life coach, right?

Mikhail Saidov: 

Yeah. It’s so interesting. I had a conversation the other day and she basically told me, “Oh, I’m a life coach now.” And I’m like, “Oh really? So where did you train?” And she’s like, “Oh, I went to this place and we got trained over the weekend.” I’m like, “Okay. You know, that’s the problem.”

Chris Cooper: 

<laugh> yeah. It’s very common in the fitness world too, honestly. You know, very common and it’s hard to discern who is qualified and who is continuing their education. So , let’s just talk about that a little bit more your program . So first off, where should people be going if they want to find out more about the program?

Mikhail Saidov: 

So they need to set up an interview with me. We have a new batch starting in the end of may. And I can give you my contact information. So probably is gonna be my team who will be setting up the interview with me. There will be a few questions before the interview. And then once they come for the interview, they will have to coach me. Now they don’t need to be licensed or certified. They just need to have a common sense and I will give them a problem and I will see how their mind works. The interview will take max 20-25 minutes and I will tell them right away if they’re a good fit for the program. Okay. If not, I will recommend something else. Once they pass the interview, we will set up three things for them. So number one is their group, where they’re gonna be supervised and where they will be practicing the material. Also when to come for lectures and the lectures are generally life , and this is like every week and who is their partner, assuming they will be, you know, working together. So generally it takes between five and seven hours every week for 12 months. There Will be practicums as well. And the practicum is when we get together for a week and we work nonstop until we see that their level of understanding progresses really fast. What also is interesting is that if you got certified, it’s pretty much guaranteed that you’re gonna get a job. It’s either- And if you want to get a job, because we’ll also teach them how to build their own business as a coach. But if they want to get a job, we will give a blind offer with 60K as an annual salary and they can start working for our company.

Chris Cooper: 

That’s amazing. And I love how much faith you have in your own program, especially in a marketplace that’s seeing kind of an influx of life coaches and people with these work weekend certifications, as you said. Should people visit thinkmeta .ai to find out more?

Mikhail Saidov: 

So think meta.ai is not the platform for coaches. Yeah. So for now we have , I think actually it is on thinkmeta. So we have our landing page for the program on thinkmeta, but I will send you the link.

Chris Cooper: 

Wonderful. We’ll put that in the show notes.

Mikhail Saidov: 

And you can share that and then there will be a button to show how they can schedule an interview. And then I hope to see someone from your audience, you know, to join us because , well, that’s, that’s gonna be the best decision of their lifetime, I promise.

Chris Cooper: 

Yeah. I think more and more fitness coaches, especially in the nutrition side are understanding that it’s not the workouts that you give somebody, it’s the behavior that you create that ultimately determines success. And now I understand you’re not just giving people advice, but you’re actually reprogramming their brain and their thought process. It’s brilliant. So Misha, thank you so much for coming on. I’m sure people are gonna reach out to you with questions or just general interests. But this has been really enlightening for me and I’ve got three pages of notes and sticky notes and everything here. So, thank you so much for helping us out.

Mikhail Saidov: 

Chris. I appreciate you for inviting me to the show. I loved your questions and hope to talk soon.

Chris Cooper: 

Thanks, man.

Mikhail Saidov: 

Yeah. Thanks.

Mike Warkentin: 

Thanks for listening! Be sure to subscribe for more great shows just like this. Now, here’s Chris with a final note.

Chris Cooper: 

If you aren’t in the Gym Owners United group on Facebook, this is my personal invitation to join. It’s the only public Facebook group that I participate in and I’m in there all the time with tips, tactics, and free resources. I’d love to network with you and help you grow your business. Join Gym Owners United on Facebook.

Thanks for listening!

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